A startup building a layer alongside an incumbent is difficult to scale unless it later finds a niche for expansion.

“It's really tough. It like caps you unless you find some niche to kind of like, uh, expand into later on. Um, the other approach is we just go downmark- you know, go downmarket, service the SMB and mid-market, and you see that with a lot of, you know, competitors to Workday, competitors to Salesforce.”